norm is down....hahahohoho
- Thread starter redbenjoe
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71spud
Member (SA)
I am in the process of being screwed... Apparently USPS signature confirmation does not show any progress in shipping. It only shows activity when it is signed for. Well the $850 box I returned to the seller is not showing any activity beyond the post office accepting it. And I had to ship it USPS to a PO box because that is the only address the bastard had. It is now 18 days after I sent it out and 12 days after he was scheduled to receive it. I suspect he is ignoring the notices. Now ebay gave me 10 days to "track down the package" or they will reverse the case and find for the seller... and I will be out BOTH the $850, return shipping, and the box itself. All he has to do is wait it out and he will end up with EVERYTHING as USPS will not be returning the package as undeliverable until way after my 10 day window to respond to ebay.
It makes me fricking sick..... :annoyed:
It makes me fricking sick..... :annoyed:
BMoney
Member (SA)
If the seller ignores the delivery notices for too long, USPS will send the package back to you. If you shipped it via Priority Mail, it will come back to you at no extra charge. If you shipped it via a cheaper method like Parcel Post, it will return to you postage due. If eBay decides in the sellers favor due to a missed deadline, and then the seller decides to sign for it, you'll then have your signature acceptance proof and eBay will have to overturn their decision back to your favor.
71spud
Member (SA)
I will try.... but I think I am over a barrel on this one.... I did a search... apparently the post office this package went to is one of the worst in the country... I have a suspicion that the package might even have been handed over to the seller without him having to sign for it. I am totally screwed folks... and on such a high dollar item.... :annoyed:
BMoney
Member (SA)
Your suspicions could be right. But, if the package was handed over to the seller without his signature, then it becomes the Postal Service's responsibility to find out what happened to the package. Especially since you paid for Signature Confirmation. If the USPS can't confirm where your package ended up, they're responsible for its value. Did you insure it?
Look. Don't wait. Be proactive, track down the number for that post office, ask to speak to a supervisor, and tell them you need them to return that parcel, like NOW if it can't be delivered.
sony_apm_fan
Member (SA)
Superduper said:
Couldn't agree more. Go in early, and hard on this one. Get the facts and push for the outcome you want.
Best of luck.
Lasonic TRC-920
Moderator
Go to USPS.com and click on "locate a post office." Type in the zip code the item was sent to and note the phone number for that station. Call and ask to speak with a supervisor or manager. Be assertive. You can not force the postoffice to deliver something the seller doesn't want to accept, nor can you force the seller to pick up the package. Signature confirmation is not a great idea since it forces the recipient to sign and if they are expecting it -- it's safe to say that they will resist any effort for a return of that item. UPS or Fedex are both better options since all delivery attempts are logged. You might be able get the post office to provide you with a letter explaining all delivery attempts (and notices left) if you get a sympathetic supervisor on the line.
Anyhow, once you have the supervisor on the line -- ask that the item be returned to you. As the shipper, you have that right. It's not ideal for you but better to recover the item and resell it for something rather than risk losing both the item and it's payment. Also, you can call eBay and speak to a representative and explain your situation. Ask them for direction, and offer to ship the item to eBay since seller will not pick up the item.
Anyhow, once you have the supervisor on the line -- ask that the item be returned to you. As the shipper, you have that right. It's not ideal for you but better to recover the item and resell it for something rather than risk losing both the item and it's payment. Also, you can call eBay and speak to a representative and explain your situation. Ask them for direction, and offer to ship the item to eBay since seller will not pick up the item.
71spud
Member (SA)
I tracked down the post office ---
Flatbush Post Office
2273 Church Ave
Brooklyn, NY 11226
I was worried because I saw people giving this post office an average of 1 star for customer service. After about 30 rings someone picked up. She was actually rather nice and seemed to want to be helpful. I gave her the PO box number, the Signature Confirmation number, and at first she looked at the Sig Confirmation number and said it was still in Wisconsin. I asked if she could check and see if it was in her post office and in about a minute she found the package... it was still there. So that is a good thing. She said she would "scan the tracking" and leave him another notice. She could not tell me how many notices were already left. Tracking for the USPS does not instantly update so I am going to give it some time and check it again. Of course if it does show up it will just look like it took 3 weeks to arrive, instead of sitting there for 2 weeks like it probably was. At least I know where it is and I still stand a chance of getting something out of this. I don't know what is going to satisfy ebay other than either an acceptance or a refusal. The package just sitting at the post office might not trigger anything in my favor.
Flatbush Post Office
2273 Church Ave
Brooklyn, NY 11226
I was worried because I saw people giving this post office an average of 1 star for customer service. After about 30 rings someone picked up. She was actually rather nice and seemed to want to be helpful. I gave her the PO box number, the Signature Confirmation number, and at first she looked at the Sig Confirmation number and said it was still in Wisconsin. I asked if she could check and see if it was in her post office and in about a minute she found the package... it was still there. So that is a good thing. She said she would "scan the tracking" and leave him another notice. She could not tell me how many notices were already left. Tracking for the USPS does not instantly update so I am going to give it some time and check it again. Of course if it does show up it will just look like it took 3 weeks to arrive, instead of sitting there for 2 weeks like it probably was. At least I know where it is and I still stand a chance of getting something out of this. I don't know what is going to satisfy ebay other than either an acceptance or a refusal. The package just sitting at the post office might not trigger anything in my favor.
71spud
Member (SA)
Well that didn't take long to show up in the tracking once she scanned it....
*****************************************************************************
Expected Delivery Date: December 22, 2010
Class: Package Services
Service(s): Signature Confirmationâ„¢
Status: Arrival at Post Office
Your item arrived at 9:21 am on December 21, 2010 in BROOKLYN, NY 11226. The Postal Service expects to deliver the item on Wednesday, December 22, 2010. Information, if available, is updated periodically throughout the day. Please check again later.
Detailed Results:
Arrival at Post Office, December 21, 2010, 9:21 am, BROOKLYN, NY 11226
Acceptance, December 01, 2010, 4:55 pm, OSHKOSH, WI 54902
*****************************************************************************
I don't know if that will help to get him to the post office to pick it up, but at least it is a step in the right direction.
*****************************************************************************
Expected Delivery Date: December 22, 2010
Class: Package Services
Service(s): Signature Confirmationâ„¢
Status: Arrival at Post Office
Your item arrived at 9:21 am on December 21, 2010 in BROOKLYN, NY 11226. The Postal Service expects to deliver the item on Wednesday, December 22, 2010. Information, if available, is updated periodically throughout the day. Please check again later.
Detailed Results:
Arrival at Post Office, December 21, 2010, 9:21 am, BROOKLYN, NY 11226
Acceptance, December 01, 2010, 4:55 pm, OSHKOSH, WI 54902
*****************************************************************************
I don't know if that will help to get him to the post office to pick it up, but at least it is a step in the right direction.
71spud
Member (SA)
Well, so far no real good news. This is the current status---
Delivery status not updated, Dec-22-10, 23:22 PM
Out for Delivery, Dec-22-10, 09:22 AM, BROOKLYN, NY, 11226
Sorting Complete, Dec-22-10, 09:12 AM, BROOKLYN, NY, 11226
Arrival at Post Office, Dec-21-10, 09:21 AM, BROOKLYN, NY, 11226
Acceptance, Dec-01-10, 16:55 PM, OSHKOSH, WI, 54902
I called ebay thinking this would be enough movement in the tracking to get them to give me a refund. It shows it is "out for delivery" and with a PO box that is a "notice left". Nope. Went through two levels of customer service and the ONLY THING other than the seller signing for the package would be for me to have the Post Office sent Ebay a FAX with the following information----
- Signature Delivery number AND a statement that attempts have been made to deliver the package because notices have been left AND they are being ignored AND the item number AND my ebay user ID AND the claim number AND a request that it be forwarded to the ebay rep AND his special rep code. Good Grief.
What are the odds that a Post Office will even send a fax with even the most basic information, not counting all the special info I need? Ebay is giving me the rules to follow, but with a PO box it is a huge loophole for the seller to avoid the package for as long as he wants.
So I called the post office (again), talked to a lady (different than Monday) and explained things to her, she would only direct me to the tracking that was available (see above) and that was it. Nothing else. Then she said "wait a minute" and put me on hold for 30 minutes and never came back. So I called back again and got a guy who was VERY COMBATIVE AND DISMISSIVE WITH ME. He would not even let me finish a sentence. He stood by the Dec 21st as the first day this package was in the post office. Nevermind it was supposed to be there on the 7th. AND that it was scanned in minutes after I called and the lady found the package. He gave me all the standard BS and made it sound like I was a complete idiot for wanting to do anything other than wait. It took a LONG TIME for me to finally break him down to where he was listening to me. I really was trying to be nice to him, but he was making it (almost) impossible.
Once I was able to FINALLY explain the whole thing to him he started to be more helpful. I said that I had the tracking, and I know what it "looks like", but I was trying to determine if the package has been there over two weeks or if notices were just starting to be left. And I was hoping being right there he would have more information. I was just trying to figure out how to proceed I told him, and that MY hands were tied. He then started to do more checking (like I was hoping he would). It turns out they will hold a package at a PO BOX FOREVER AS LONG AS THE BOX IS CURRENT. And he checked. This box is paid up through next year and the person has had the box a long time. Next he checked and said there was NO MAIL in the box, except for the notice. No mail since Monday? Assuming she left a notice on Monday... for sure Tuesday. This time of the year you would think he would have had something. So he checked the guys contact information. Guess what. There was nothing other than a name. So he LOCKED THE PO BOX until the guy updates his information!!!!!! So now if he wants his mail.... he has to ask for it... and update his info. *evil grin* Oh, I also told the PO guy that after the 29th the seller will get the released funds and is free to pick up the package and he will be committing FRAUD when he does so. Maybe that helped.... Of course there is the possibility that they guy receives his normal mail some other way, perhaps even at an address, but keeps this box just for his ebay dealings so it is easy for him to avoid. Not a ton of feedback for him, only 162 since April 2001. So he does not do the volume to justify that... Just worrying out loud...
The Post Office guy even gave me his direct phone number and if the package is not picked up by Monday he said he would write a letter for me. (at first he said 5 days, but when I said ebay gave me until the 29th he said 5 days was cutting it close and said Monday) Turns out in the end he was not so bad, but it was pretty rough going in the beginning. I am surprised we were ever able to communicate. In the end I wished him a Merry Christmas, but now I am hoping I didn't offend him by doing so... I am so not "Politically Correct" and it gets me in trouble sometimes.
Delivery status not updated, Dec-22-10, 23:22 PM
Out for Delivery, Dec-22-10, 09:22 AM, BROOKLYN, NY, 11226
Sorting Complete, Dec-22-10, 09:12 AM, BROOKLYN, NY, 11226
Arrival at Post Office, Dec-21-10, 09:21 AM, BROOKLYN, NY, 11226
Acceptance, Dec-01-10, 16:55 PM, OSHKOSH, WI, 54902
I called ebay thinking this would be enough movement in the tracking to get them to give me a refund. It shows it is "out for delivery" and with a PO box that is a "notice left". Nope. Went through two levels of customer service and the ONLY THING other than the seller signing for the package would be for me to have the Post Office sent Ebay a FAX with the following information----
- Signature Delivery number AND a statement that attempts have been made to deliver the package because notices have been left AND they are being ignored AND the item number AND my ebay user ID AND the claim number AND a request that it be forwarded to the ebay rep AND his special rep code. Good Grief.
What are the odds that a Post Office will even send a fax with even the most basic information, not counting all the special info I need? Ebay is giving me the rules to follow, but with a PO box it is a huge loophole for the seller to avoid the package for as long as he wants.
So I called the post office (again), talked to a lady (different than Monday) and explained things to her, she would only direct me to the tracking that was available (see above) and that was it. Nothing else. Then she said "wait a minute" and put me on hold for 30 minutes and never came back. So I called back again and got a guy who was VERY COMBATIVE AND DISMISSIVE WITH ME. He would not even let me finish a sentence. He stood by the Dec 21st as the first day this package was in the post office. Nevermind it was supposed to be there on the 7th. AND that it was scanned in minutes after I called and the lady found the package. He gave me all the standard BS and made it sound like I was a complete idiot for wanting to do anything other than wait. It took a LONG TIME for me to finally break him down to where he was listening to me. I really was trying to be nice to him, but he was making it (almost) impossible.
Once I was able to FINALLY explain the whole thing to him he started to be more helpful. I said that I had the tracking, and I know what it "looks like", but I was trying to determine if the package has been there over two weeks or if notices were just starting to be left. And I was hoping being right there he would have more information. I was just trying to figure out how to proceed I told him, and that MY hands were tied. He then started to do more checking (like I was hoping he would). It turns out they will hold a package at a PO BOX FOREVER AS LONG AS THE BOX IS CURRENT. And he checked. This box is paid up through next year and the person has had the box a long time. Next he checked and said there was NO MAIL in the box, except for the notice. No mail since Monday? Assuming she left a notice on Monday... for sure Tuesday. This time of the year you would think he would have had something. So he checked the guys contact information. Guess what. There was nothing other than a name. So he LOCKED THE PO BOX until the guy updates his information!!!!!! So now if he wants his mail.... he has to ask for it... and update his info. *evil grin* Oh, I also told the PO guy that after the 29th the seller will get the released funds and is free to pick up the package and he will be committing FRAUD when he does so. Maybe that helped.... Of course there is the possibility that they guy receives his normal mail some other way, perhaps even at an address, but keeps this box just for his ebay dealings so it is easy for him to avoid. Not a ton of feedback for him, only 162 since April 2001. So he does not do the volume to justify that... Just worrying out loud...
The Post Office guy even gave me his direct phone number and if the package is not picked up by Monday he said he would write a letter for me. (at first he said 5 days, but when I said ebay gave me until the 29th he said 5 days was cutting it close and said Monday) Turns out in the end he was not so bad, but it was pretty rough going in the beginning. I am surprised we were ever able to communicate. In the end I wished him a Merry Christmas, but now I am hoping I didn't offend him by doing so... I am so not "Politically Correct" and it gets me in trouble sometimes.
BMoney
Member (SA)
Sorry to hear you're having to deal with all that Spud. I really think you should try to get that package back in your possession though. Norm recommended that too. I know it would probably feel like you're taking a step back in the whole process but you really don't want eBay to release funds while the guy has access to the goods. That would be a lose lose situation for you. And USPS isn't much help either.
71spud
Member (SA)
Well I feel a *bit* better now that I have an "in" with a guy in the post office. Hopefully the guy picks up the package soon. With his mailbox being unaccessible to him he might be forced to acknowledge the package one way or another. Of course he could always come up with some sort of story that would turn the post office guy against me too. I am going to give it the weekend. Nothing will happen until the 29th anyway. I still have Monday and Tuesday to make a final decision.
If he has not picked up the package by Monday I am calling the post office to see if I can get the letter faxed. Then I am calling ebay one way or another and talk to the actual rep that put it on a 10 day hold in the first place, forcing the 29th deadline. The chick I talked to today I think was too quick to dismiss my case. The actual wording in the email was unclear in some areas... which I will not bore you with. If I get more activity in the tracking that would help my case.
If it gets down to the very end and ebay does not budge and the Post Office won't budge then I will have them send it back. Until the very end I am not comfortable doing so. I don't think he would be so obvious as to wait until the email comes through that the case was reversed and then run in the post office to sign for it. I want my money.... not the poorly packed, damaged, not as described item I was sold.
If he has not picked up the package by Monday I am calling the post office to see if I can get the letter faxed. Then I am calling ebay one way or another and talk to the actual rep that put it on a 10 day hold in the first place, forcing the 29th deadline. The chick I talked to today I think was too quick to dismiss my case. The actual wording in the email was unclear in some areas... which I will not bore you with. If I get more activity in the tracking that would help my case.
If it gets down to the very end and ebay does not budge and the Post Office won't budge then I will have them send it back. Until the very end I am not comfortable doing so. I don't think he would be so obvious as to wait until the email comes through that the case was reversed and then run in the post office to sign for it. I want my money.... not the poorly packed, damaged, not as described item I was sold.
71spud
Member (SA)
No movement on the tracking at all... so it has not been picked up. Tried calling the post office, but it was busy all day yesterday. Probably the snow. Then I called ebay, talked my way through two levels of ebay support. Got a very helpful woman who ran it further up the flagpole to a special team and after calling the seller herself (no answer) she said I had done everything I could and that she was closing out the case in my favor and I would get my full refund. Holding off celebration still at this point because 23 hours later my case still shows open on ebay and no change in PayPal either. Odd thing is my PayPal account now has the tracking number of the package I sent back in it, showing that it is waiting on delivery. Don't know how long that has been there, but it is possible that PayPal might be yet another hurdle to jump? This is getting beyond extreme....
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